Comments on: Your choice: whine about Flash crashing, or help make it better http://www.davidarno.org/2010/02/08/your-choice-whine-about-flash-crashing-or-help-make-it-better/ Tue, 07 Feb 2012 22:10:57 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Kevin Newman http://www.davidarno.org/2010/02/08/your-choice-whine-about-flash-crashing-or-help-make-it-better/comment-page-1/#comment-3368 Kevin Newman Sun, 28 Feb 2010 20:08:06 +0000 http://www.davidarno.org/?p=1093#comment-3368 I was speaking generally (since I can't actually log into JIRA - it simply won't let me) - but I would think it's impossible to actually fix any particular bug without access to the source - and motivation to do so is appropriately lacking without that source... Anyway, the success of the open source Flex Framework demonstrates what I meant. That project does receive the kind of positive attention from the community that good usable open source projects tend to attract. Even Tamarin (which was largely seen as a failed OSS experiment within Adobe, if I read those tea leaves correctly) has received some positive results on the smaller parts of it (nano-jit) that were adopted by Mozilla (that project was largely an unusable code dump - if it had been released within a buildable framework, I bet it would have been more successful). Anyway, I can imagine some risks with opening the source (particularly with Apple and forking) - but I really think that can be mitigated with a proper management/rollout/transition plan. I was speaking generally (since I can’t actually log into JIRA – it simply won’t let me) – but I would think it’s impossible to actually fix any particular bug without access to the source – and motivation to do so is appropriately lacking without that source…

Anyway, the success of the open source Flex Framework demonstrates what I meant. That project does receive the kind of positive attention from the community that good usable open source projects tend to attract.

Even Tamarin (which was largely seen as a failed OSS experiment within Adobe, if I read those tea leaves correctly) has received some positive results on the smaller parts of it (nano-jit) that were adopted by Mozilla (that project was largely an unusable code dump – if it had been released within a buildable framework, I bet it would have been more successful).

Anyway, I can imagine some risks with opening the source (particularly with Apple and forking) – but I really think that can be mitigated with a proper management/rollout/transition plan.

]]> By: do what ? http://www.davidarno.org/2010/02/08/your-choice-whine-about-flash-crashing-or-help-make-it-better/comment-page-1/#comment-3193 do what ? Fri, 12 Feb 2010 06:50:58 +0000 http://www.davidarno.org/?p=1093#comment-3193 beta test what ? man are you smoking some heavy weed over there ? stop it, it's not amusing any more. I can't test my own software projects enough and I'm supposed to test theirs ?! Flash should expire soon as a technology anyway ...

beta test what ? man are you smoking some heavy weed over there ? stop it, it’s not amusing any more. I can’t test my own software projects enough and I’m supposed to test theirs ?! Flash should expire soon as a technology anyway …

]]> By: do what ? http://www.davidarno.org/2010/02/08/your-choice-whine-about-flash-crashing-or-help-make-it-better/comment-page-1/#comment-3192 do what ? Fri, 12 Feb 2010 06:49:34 +0000 http://www.davidarno.org/?p=1093#comment-3192 do what ? are you kidding me ? solve bugs for someone who is making a lot of money for a product that's not worth a penny ? nice try !

do what ?
are you kidding me ?
solve bugs for someone who is making a lot of money for a product that’s not worth a penny ? nice try !

]]> By: Ian Eiloart http://www.davidarno.org/2010/02/08/your-choice-whine-about-flash-crashing-or-help-make-it-better/comment-page-1/#comment-3170 Ian Eiloart Mon, 08 Feb 2010 21:57:28 +0000 http://www.davidarno.org/?p=1093#comment-3170 Kevin, I know exactly what you mean. I filed a bug on Apple's Mail.app 10 years ago. They tried to fix it a few years later, and nearly got it right. I filed a bug report - they need to remove two characters from a message header to be RFC compliant. A few years later on, I've filed six reports on this trivial bug, and they've still not fixed it. In contrast, I filed a feature request on the open source Exim. The following day I was told where to modify the source (which I was able to recompile to my satisfaction), and the next release contained the feature. When there's an open flash client, I'll contribute bug reports. Kevin, I know exactly what you mean. I filed a bug on Apple’s Mail.app 10 years ago. They tried to fix it a few years later, and nearly got it right. I filed a bug report – they need to remove two characters from a message header to be RFC compliant. A few years later on, I’ve filed six reports on this trivial bug, and they’ve still not fixed it.

In contrast, I filed a feature request on the open source Exim. The following day I was told where to modify the source (which I was able to recompile to my satisfaction), and the next release contained the feature.

When there’s an open flash client, I’ll contribute bug reports.

]]> By: Jim Connolly http://www.davidarno.org/2010/02/08/your-choice-whine-about-flash-crashing-or-help-make-it-better/comment-page-1/#comment-3169 Jim Connolly Mon, 08 Feb 2010 20:41:44 +0000 http://www.davidarno.org/?p=1093#comment-3169 I've been seeing all the negative comments, and Flash has always run pretty nicely on my Macs. But I will do my part, especially when I try out AIR. I’ve been seeing all the negative comments, and Flash has always run pretty nicely on my Macs. But I will do my part, especially when I try out AIR.

]]> By: Kevin Newman http://www.davidarno.org/2010/02/08/your-choice-whine-about-flash-crashing-or-help-make-it-better/comment-page-1/#comment-3167 Kevin Newman Mon, 08 Feb 2010 19:08:11 +0000 http://www.davidarno.org/?p=1093#comment-3167 It's weird to file bugs for a project with such a closed development environment. I've filed bugs with Mozilla, WebKit, PHP, Wordpress and others, and I find it refreshing to see the bugs get dealt with, or even sit around, get marked as dupes, etc. Nothing is more frustrating that filing a bug only to watch it languish. Well, actually it is more frustrating when the project is someone else's private project, and they don't communicate well (for example where are the details on the performance improvements in Flash 10.1 aside from just the GPU codec work). I'm not trying to be a jerk about open source, but there's a reason that system works to draw in community participation. If Adobe really believes that proprietary development (of a platform they ultimately give away for free) is necessary or better - then let them prove it, and stop "whining" about all the whining. And yes, I usually say the same to the open source pinheads (and no they are not all pinheads), who think that open source is always better (so binary). It’s weird to file bugs for a project with such a closed development environment. I’ve filed bugs with Mozilla, WebKit, PHP, WordPress and others, and I find it refreshing to see the bugs get dealt with, or even sit around, get marked as dupes, etc. Nothing is more frustrating that filing a bug only to watch it languish. Well, actually it is more frustrating when the project is someone else’s private project, and they don’t communicate well (for example where are the details on the performance improvements in Flash 10.1 aside from just the GPU codec work).

I’m not trying to be a jerk about open source, but there’s a reason that system works to draw in community participation. If Adobe really believes that proprietary development (of a platform they ultimately give away for free) is necessary or better – then let them prove it, and stop “whining” about all the whining. And yes, I usually say the same to the open source pinheads (and no they are not all pinheads), who think that open source is always better (so binary).

]]> By: P.J. Onori http://www.davidarno.org/2010/02/08/your-choice-whine-about-flash-crashing-or-help-make-it-better/comment-page-1/#comment-3166 P.J. Onori Mon, 08 Feb 2010 17:44:40 +0000 http://www.davidarno.org/?p=1093#comment-3166 Believe me, I understand what you are trying to say, but at the end of the day, until the Flash runtimes are open, the onus is on Adobe to make a quality product. We can beta test until we're red in the face, but they need to actually fix the bugs. I don't think I am the only one to have logged bugs in Adobe's bug tracker to no response. Considering the lack of control the community ultimately has over this, whining seems to be the next logical step. Believe me, I understand what you are trying to say, but at the end of the day, until the Flash runtimes are open, the onus is on Adobe to make a quality product. We can beta test until we’re red in the face, but they need to actually fix the bugs.

I don’t think I am the only one to have logged bugs in Adobe’s bug tracker to no response. Considering the lack of control the community ultimately has over this, whining seems to be the next logical step.

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